He and Anakin met in the middle of the deserted street. During their years as Master and Padawan he’d done his best to break Anakin’s childish dependence on demonstrations of affection. He’d failed. And now, full of relief, he found himself reaching out to clasp his former student’s shoulder.
that’s not a demonstration of affection you repressed attached in-denial twat
“If anyone can, you can,” said Anakin. And because he was Anakin, and so tired, and had only ever pretended to learn that lesson of distance, gave [Obi-Wan] a swift embrace.
I’ve always had some serious, massive thoughts and feels about this scene where Obi-Wan watches the hologram of Anakin slaughtering the Jedi, kneeling at Palpatine’s feet, and everything else that followed.
To begin with, I don’t think Obi-Wan had any idea of what he was about to see. Yoda said he would only find pain if he watched, but Obi-Wan said he “had to know.” To me, he meant, “I have to know how my son/brother/BFF/lover/whatever died.” Because such was Obi-Wan’s faith in Anakin Skywalker that it never occurred to him that Anakin would commit such atrocities. In his mind, Anakin’s body is lying somewhere in the Temple, surrounded by over a dozen dead clones and the younglings he was seeking to protect. He needed to see Anakin’s fate so that it would be real for him, otherwise he’d always cling to some delusional hope that Anakin was somehow still alive.
Then he sees the truth, watches Anakin slaughter their brethren, but what next catches my attention is the moment he watches Anakin kneel before Palpatine. My headcanon is that Anakin has always had some serious issues about kneeling before anyone, going back to his life on Tatooine. Watto may not have been the type to have Anakin or Shmi kneeling in subservience, but Anakin very likely witnessed other slaves being forced to do so before their owners, and it was something that sickened him. That feeling was likely something he carried over into his life as a Jedi, and he may have actually been able to communicate it to Obi-Wan on some level. Hence why Obi-Wan looks like he’s trying not to vomit as he stares at Anakin on his knees before Palpatine. He knows that Anakin despises that sort of posture and behavior – so what has happened to make Anakin go back on that? How did things change so much since he left for Utapau?
This is quite possibly the origin of Obi-Wan blaming himself for all that happened. Obi-Wan clung so tightly to his faith that everything was hunky-dorey that he didn’t see that something was clearly wrong with Anakin, that he needed help. He knew that there was the problem of asking Anakin to spy on Palpatine (see the novelization where he basically tells the Council off for being morons on the subject), but he had no idea of the other issues that were crushing Anakin under their collective heels (the nightmares of Padmé’s death, etc), in part because Anakin didn’t confide in him but also in part because Obi-Wan did not ask. Fanon likes to think that Obi-Wan figured out a long time ago about Anakin and Padmé (because subtle they are not), but he never came out and said anything about it. Perhaps he came to believe that if he had actually sat Anakin down and talked to him, gotten him to share his burdens, then he would have been able to help Anakin before he drowned. We know Anakin did go to Yoda for help about Padmé but got the singularly unhelpful advice of “someone dies – have a party, you should, for one with the Force they are!”, but one would think that Obi-Wan’s advice might have been a little more practical, say something like “Have Padmé get checked out by a few healers, ones who specialize in pregnancy and childbirth, to head off any potential problems.” And that’s just one example.
To continue: Obi-Wan watches his brother/BFF/lover/whatever systematically slaughter their people, and then is told by Yoda that he must destroy him to save the Republic (never mind the fact that the Republic was dead long before all of this went down, but that’s a rant for another time). Yoda maintains that Anakin is already dead, and all that remains is Darth Vader who is basically possessing Anakin’s corpse. In all honesty, I think Obi-Wan kind of went on autopilot at this point, which is why he sounded so wooden and vacant when he kept telling Padmé what a threat Anakin now was. He couldn’t bring himself to believe it, not then.
In all honesty, I don’t think Obi-Wan really believed that this was all happening until he saw Padmé be Force-choked on Mustafar. Because the real Anakin would have sooner gnawed off his remaining flesh arm than do anything to harm Padmé, and Obi-Wan knew that. That’s why he looked so utterly horrified when he stared down at Padmé’s crumpled form (besides the fact that, you know, she had just been choked and that could very well kill her and her baby). That’s when it finally hit home that this was Darth Fucking Vader and not Anakin Skywalker. And I’m pretty sure what was left of Obi-Wan’s heart just shattered.
This is a scene where Anakin is completely emasculated. That’s what it exists for. That is the sole purpose it exists for. He is actually assigned to provide and coordinate Padme’s security, given authority by the Chancellor, the Senate, the Jedi, and Padme’s own personal security, Captain Typho. He has every right to say that he is in charge of security and that Padme should, at least, confer with him before making declarations to the Queen about their security plans.
Padme doesn’t see him as a Jedi. At all. It’s not even an issue of her deciding to undercut her security, or distrusting in his abilities. He’s that little boy from Tatooine to her and therefore it doesn’t even occur to her to afford him the respect she would to Obi-Wan, or again, to her own security, Captain Typho.
And here’s what I like about this: it isn’t motivation for Anakin. I think you can, very broadly, drawn a line from here to RotS in terms of his objections to the Council allowing Palpatine to appoint him but not granting him the status of Master. He does crave recognition, in addition to power in the Force and actual authority. But in terms of his relationship to Padme, this moment is wholly irrelevant from his POV. He never sets out to prove her wrong about him, to prove that she lacks security expertise, that she shouldn’t question his abilities. Sit back and think about that. Think of all the movies out there where a moment like this eventually generates a comeuppance, even if it’s merely as tame as the woman “admitting” she was wrong to underestimate the man (obviously this exists also in reverse; we almost always get the woman then saying her daddy taught her or she grew up with five brothers). Her treatment of him here is by no means motive for Mustafar. His declared, canon reason for attacking her is that he believes she brought Obi-Wan to kill him. He claims only that she doesn’t love him – not that she has never respected him, not that she has never believed in him or trusted him.
I think it terms of storytelling, this is an extremely unusual choice. I think it’s an unusually good one.
The picnic scene in AOTC inspires such backlash and huge amount of criticism – some say the scene doesn’t even feel like SW and its only aim is to show Harlequin-type of romance to appeal to the female audience, others argue that it basically shows Anakin having facist tendencies and it’s the moment Padmé should have run away from him. It’s such a pity because there are so many things going on in that scene – the symbolism, the political and social commentary, all the things it reveals about Anakin’s personality and motivation,… – and it has many different levels.
It’s funny how so many people automatically deduce from the dictatorship conversation that Anakin is twisted and that the relationship between him and Padmé would never work. Everyone is ready to jump on the “inherently evil and twisted” bandwagon just because a 19-year-old man freely voices his personal opinion in a free society which respects the freedom of expression and opinion. They condemn him without giving him the benefit of doubt. It’s a bias stemming from the fact that THEY KNOW HE WILL BECOME DARTH VADER, THE EPITOME OF OF EVIL, ergo him supporting dictatorship makes him already guilty of much worse crimes.
As if “dictatorship” was the most taboo word in the world. Just uttering it makes him guilty in almost everyone’s eyes. It’s much worse than if he said the F-word (actually, if he did it most people would think him cool). However, what people fail to see is that an opinion and actually acting on it are two completely different things. It feels ironic that the same people who accuse Anakin of being written as a moody teenager vilify him for having a mature and relevant conversation about such sophisticated topic as the political organization of society.
Anakin in AOTC is portrayed with naivité that is typical for his age but also cynism of a man who has seen too much too soon, and this combination makes him much more mature than a typical teenager. However, most of all, Anakin is an idealist who he sees the system isn’t working and Padmé sees it, as well. However, when he offers dictatorship as a way of reforming the system, Padmé cannot offer other solution because she doesn’t have one, even though her own belief tells her dictatorship is wrong, and she can only show incredulity. In that moment, Anakin doesn’t defend dictatorship because he wants to rule the Galaxy himself (that only happens after he joins Sidious), but because he sees it as an alternative to a system that has been failing and HE ACTUALLY SAW PEOPLE DIE BECAUSE OF IT, SAW THEIR SUFFERING AS HE WAS HELPLESS TO SAVE THEM. HE BLED FOR THAT SYSTEM, HE FOUGHT EACH DAY WHILE RISKING HIS LIFE TO PROTECT THAT SYSTEM OUT OF LOYALTY, HONOUR AND HIS VOWS BUT IT KEPT DISAPPOINTING HIM OVER AND OVER AGAIN. He had left his mother in slavery for what she’d hoped to be his freedom, but he ended up realizing that the politicians he serves are as corrupted and evil as the criminals on Tatooine. In ROTS it’s strongly implied how he has stopped believing in what he’s fighting for because that very thing has become corrupted. One of the reasons why he wants to go with Obi-wan to Utapau is because with him he feels he is doing the right thing – with him he feels there are still things worth fighting for in the Galaxy.
Another level is that people forget that the real point of that scene isn’t about Anakin showing to be in favour of dictatorship nor it’s about politics – it’s about an argument and a debate, about philosophy, the importance of discussion and a point of view, because there is no such thing as an absolute truth or a perfect system. George Lucas is famous for working with motifs and ideologies in his Saga and that fact is even more pronounced in the Prequels as the conversation between Padmé and Anakin is an allusion to the Greek history and philosophy which gave birth to the ideas of political systems. Aristotle himself, who lived in the democratic Athens and is considered to be one of the greatest thinkers and philosophers of all time, was a passionate advocate of autocracy, which he considered to be the best type of political system, and the rule of a benevolent dictator while he deemed democracy as the worst of all the political systems. The flaw is not in any of the systems, it’s in the people – be it communism, autocracy or democracy (or dynamite), originally they were all noble ideas to help people. However, each time the philosophers and their founders assumed that the people who would hold the power would be righteous and incorruptable and that was their common mistake because the people are weak and greedy and power corrupts.
Finally, about Padmé’s reaction to Anakin’s opinions – it’s obvious it shocks her but it also intrigues her because no man would ever dare to openly and frankly voice his political beliefs which are considered by the general society as politically incorrect. He believes in the same things as she does – the prosperity of people – but not neccessarily in the same methods with which he would achieve it. And why? Because he was shaped differently than Padmé who always had the freedom to shape her own destiny and the possibilities and means to freely fight for her people and her beliefs, but for the most parts she was sheltered and protected from the terrible atrocities of war and social injustice. On the other hand, Anakin, even after being freed from slavery, was never sheltered and as Obi-Wan’s padawan was always in the middle of battles and fights; he could never decide for himself and had to follow the orders of the Council and the Senate, left again to watch helplessly all the people he couldn’t save .
OMG, thank you for bringing this article to my attention. I feel like I’ve been defending the prequels to deaf ears for years. Now, don’t get me wrong, I love the OT. I grew up on the OT. They are comfort movies to the Nth degree… but the prequels were the Star Wars of my early 20s and I got SO attached to them, flaws and all, and honestly never understood why they got so much crap for things that the originals got a pass on. Do they have their flaws? Of course, they do. But so do the originals, and it really bothers me when people pretend that’s not so.
“The uncomfortable truth is that just about everything bad in the
prequels was also bad in the originals. Hayden Christensen is no worse
than Mark Hamill, with his whining about Tosche Station and power
converters. Jar Jar Binks is no more annoying than C-3PO, who tagged
along after R2-D2 like an unwanted dance chaperone. “It’s coarse and
rough and irritating—and it gets everywhere,” was terrible dialogue. And
don’t forget Yoda in The Empire Strikes Back: “How you get so big eating food of this kind?”
There’s
one crucial difference between the prequels and their predecessors: the
age at which many moviegoers experienced them. To become apoplectic
over the prequels while still adoring the originals has always struck me
as a strange sort of dissonance. Call it nostalgia gone sour,
petulantly whining, “You ruined my childhood!” when in actuality the Star Wars prequels’ remarkably preserved it—warts and all.”
Revenge of the Sith | Deleted Scene | Obi-Wan Visits Padmé
“I am not blind, Padmé. Though I have tried to be, for Anakin’s sake. And for yours. Anakin has loved you since the day you met, in that horrible junk shop on Tatooine. He’s never even tried to hide it, though we do not speak of it. We… pretend that I don’t know. And I was happy to, because it made him happy. You made him happy, when nothing else ever truly could.”
The deleted scene of all SW deleted scenes! The one that the PT fandom would give anything to see but probably never will due to Disney’s anti-Prequels policy: The moment Obi-Wan Kenobi officially admits that he is Anidala shipper and wordlessly confesses that he really does love Anakin Skywalker!
“You love him, too, don’t you?” When he didn’t answer she turned around. He stood motionless, frowning, in the middle of the expanse of the buff carpeting. “You do. You do love him.” He lowered his head. He looked very alone. “Please, do what you can to help him,” he said, and left.
It reveals so much about the relationship between the three, long-time friends, and sheds new light on the complexity of it, but most of all it reveals the extent of Obi-Wan’s love for Anakin when he openly admits to Padmé he has known about their forbidden relationship from the beginning and that not only has he tacitly allowed it but also silently supported it for all those years! (It’s something that got almost completely lost in ROTS, aside the tacit acknowledgement of Padmé’s pregnancy.) It explains so much about his behaviour at the end of AOTC when he sent Anakin to escort Padmé back to Naboo despite the fact that he knew better than anyone else about the possible consequences. It explains his behaviour in the hangar—it’s the moment when he chooses Anakin over the Jedi Order and decides to give him the only thing he knows that can make him happy, Padmé.
Considering he spent all his time with Anakin, Obi-Wan must have been blind not to notice him mysteriously disappearing and the sudden addition of R2 as their new teammate. Though, I’m sure the pragmatist he was Obi-Wan must have thought he still got the better end of the bargain since he didn’t need to listen to C3PO’s statistics on how low his odds of survival were. The saddest thing about it is that Anakin never realized that his friend knew nor how much he was loved by him or how fiercely protective and loyal he was. Just the mere fact that he, the stickler for rules, cared more about Anakin’s happiness and well-being than the Jedi and all their dogmas. What makes it even more special is that his visits follows the moment he told Anakin about his mission to spy on Palpatine, so him going to Padmé was the direct result of it, because Obi-Wan knew how much it hurt and disillusioned him, It shows that Obi-Wan understood Anakin and recognized how much different he was from all the other Jedi and he ACCEPTED HIM, EVERYTHING OF HIM, instead of trying to change him. It’s obvious he wanted to protect his singularity and happiness because he loved this complex, flawed man with all his flaws and weaknesses.
“I was very happy to learn of his appointment to the Council.” – Padmé
“Yes. It is perhaps less than he deserves—though I’m afraid that it can be more than he can handle.” – Obi-Wan
Futhermore, though it is short, this is such an important and private moment between Padmé and Obi-Wan – her husband’s best, and probably only, friend, the closest thing to a brother and a father he had, the man who loved her son and protected him him from the shadows even after he sacrificed himself to save him and his sister. Which was so fitting because in that way he repaid Anakin all those times he had saved his life. Also, it would be awesome to watch Padme’s reaction at hearing Obi-Wan speak about the depth of Anakin’s feelings for her, because here was the man who knew him the best and he was telling her how much and openly her husband loved her, because for all she knew, no one but a couple of droids, a priest and a handful of people loyal to her were aware of her love affair with the Jedi Knight and she no one to confide in about her private life.
Finally, the final part of the scene when Obi-Wan receives the message from Mace Windu about Grievous’s whereabouts reveals the sheer hopeless turmoil Padmé had been living through during her marriage with Anakin—that their time together was limited and that her husband could be called to war any moment and taken away from her.
Han is all “there’s to much Vader in him,” without mentioning that there is too much Vader in Leia too.
Like, Bail Organa, bless his poor poor soul, tried to politician the Vader out of her. He tried SO FUCKING HARD.
But the fact that she abandoned politics to be a General in the Resistance says a lot about her similarities to Anakin Skywalker.
See, people get it wrong. They assume because Luke got the blond hair and the lightsaber that he is Anakin’s child. He’s not. He’s Padme’s.
Leia, though. Leia is very much Anakin’s child. She is the one with the deep anger in her. She is the one who will bring peace to her new empire freedom and justice back to the galaxy whether the galaxy wants it or not. She is the one who commands armies and amasses followers as easy as breathing. She joined the Rebellion while she was in her teens. She is the one with the spirit of a warrior.
Don’t get me wrong; Bail Organa did his damnedest to raise her in the mold of her mother, fighting her battles in the halls of power with words as her weapons. And she was very good at it. But unlike Padme, Leia’s words always had an edge to them, her tone and meaning always a little too sharp, a little too angry.
Peace and mercy are the trademarks of Luke and Padme. Justice and order, obtained by whatever means necessary, are the marks of Leia and Anakin.
How the throne room scene actually should’ve gone:
“If you will not turn to the Dark Side, perhaps she will.”
“Pffffthahahahaha yeah, okay Dad, let me know how that turns out. Look, the reason I’m here instead of her is because I want you alive and not a cloud of vaporized plastic. You know she strangled Jabba the Hutt with the chain he put around her neck, right? That’s what she does to people who try to control her. Better tell your Emperor you’re not allowed to have any more ideas.”
You want to know what the biggest nonissue in Star Wars is?
Leia having memories of Padme.
And people make such a big deal about it all the time!
Leia is incredibly force sensitive! The force gives force sensitive people visions all the time! If Leia didn’t know what the force was or that she was force sensitive then she could easily mistake a force vision for a memory!
It’s literally that easy.
There are so many plot holes and in universe arguments to be had and people continue to get so worked up about this one?
The one with the easiest explanation?
So then why doesn’t Luke remember her?
If you watch Revenge of the Sith you can see that Leia’s eyes are open while Padme is dying and after. Luke’s eyes, however, are closed. George Lucas has said that this is why she has visual memories of her mother. Her eyes were open.
I still feel like that’s a bit of a stretch though. I mean I can suspend disbelief for a lot of things, but they were babies. They were just born. Ultimately George needed to communicate this better to the audience. Nice to know the reason Luke doesn’t remember Mama is because he fell asleep though. Poor Luke.
How is it a stretch though? The force is literally space magic it doesn’t work on logical rules? It gives people visions of their past and potential futures and all that.
I think that Luke heard his mother actually and didn’t realize it was a force memory because he repeats the words she spoke on her death bed almost verbatim.
There’s a difference between thinking it could have been executed better, versus debating it on forums and arguing about it… like the dudebros that were being referenced do. They are the supposedly hardcore Star Wars fans who would absolutely pick apart a scene and notice the details like Leia’s eyes being open and Luke’s being closed, but they still don’t accept that the explanation is just that. Open eyed, force sensitive Leia.
Yeah it’s like ok you guys could just admit that she’s force sensitive and have an easy explanation that makes sense or you could continue to plug your ears and close your eyes.
Now that you bring it up, I remember something. We all know Luke tends to close his eyes when using the Force. Well, there’s two points in the OT where Leia uses the Force. At the end of Empire Strikes Back, when she hears Luke calling for help:
And at the end of Return of the Jedi, when she confirms Luke’s alive for Han.
Both times, eyes wide open. Where Luke’s earliest training involves closing his eyes to get in tune with the Force, and he still does so sometimes even in the third movie. I’d go so far as to suggest Luke’s got his hood up at the end of The Force Awakens when we first see him because he was covering his eyes and trying to sense who was approaching through the Force. (And he does figure it out, which is why he’s amazed but not startled or surprised.) Leia, a few scenes earlier, senses Han on the Starkiller with her eyes open, and only closes them when it hits her what her impression means.
More than that, the way the ESB scene is edited you get the impression Leia’s seeing a vision. Luke doesn’t get visions until ESB, but he does hear voices in the original movie.
This is so interesting!
I’ve never noticed this but I did immediately think of two moments from the canon comics that we see the twins use the force:
eirenical17 